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	<title>Comments on: Kirk Hinrich (07-08 Synopsis)</title>
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	<description>A look at basketball and life with two feet set</description>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-469</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Sep 2008 20:16:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-469</guid>
		<description>First stage - considering the pick without too much thought on the Bulls specifically. 

I think the difference between Rose&#039;s potential and Beasley&#039;s potential is very large. It&#039;s not pie in the sky potential (Ty Thomas or Chandler+Curry) either, Rose has already exhibited a very high level of skill. So passing on this quality player with high potential would be very difficult for me, it would only be for a player that in one move brings my squad to title contention. I don&#039;t think Beasley does that for Chicago so I pass on Beasley and take Rose in just about every situation imaginable ... I&#039;d pass on Rose and take Beasley if I had a top 5 or so PG which Hinrich is not.

Second stage - Bulls specifically and whether or not that swings the initial scale

I&#039;d agree that the Bulls were better than they showed last season. I expected more from them, especially on the (1) defensive end and from (2) Hinrich and Deng. That said I thought the pre-season expectations last year where completely out of whack and that the Bulls were overrated. I did consider them a playoff caliber squad but also a team that would be lucky to get out of the first round (Boston, Detroit, Cleveland, Orlando all being better and likely one of who would play the Bulls in the opening round). With the improvements made once again this offseason that difference has grown even larger with the Bulls falling further down the pecking order. As I said at the start of this paragraph, I thought the Bulls underperformed and feel they can do better in the two areas I said above, plus hopefully some of their youth improves too ... so better but a long way off from where they need to be.

So with where I evaluate the Bulls to be, even with a Beasley they don&#039;t go get past the top five teams (add Phily to the other four) in the East.  I would like their chances to get back to the playoff picture though. I&#039;d consider them in that Toronto/Washington bracket and still in need of making more moves, and important moves at that. Without Beasley I&#039;m lukewarm on their chances, they&#039;ve got a shot but so do several other squads.

---------------------

As for moving Bulls guards, their good draft picks, I have no problem with that. 

I&#039;m don&#039;t really like Ben Gordon and think the Bulls are mad for offering him so much money, and Ben is even madder for turning that deal down. I think he&#039;s a fairly average player who is difficult to play off of as a go to scorer which limits his value as a scorer. He also creates a large number of problems, almost as many as he solves. And ... his value to the Bulls is seriously inflated by the team&#039;s offensive deficiencies over the past couple of years. Add in the tweener label, inability to play the point, defensive issues, limited playmaking .... like I said I regard him as a fairly average player.

I have no problem moving Kirk Hinrich when I&#039;m inserting a top point guard prospect in his place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First stage &#8211; considering the pick without too much thought on the Bulls specifically. </p>
<p>I think the difference between Rose&#8217;s potential and Beasley&#8217;s potential is very large. It&#8217;s not pie in the sky potential (Ty Thomas or Chandler+Curry) either, Rose has already exhibited a very high level of skill. So passing on this quality player with high potential would be very difficult for me, it would only be for a player that in one move brings my squad to title contention. I don&#8217;t think Beasley does that for Chicago so I pass on Beasley and take Rose in just about every situation imaginable &#8230; I&#8217;d pass on Rose and take Beasley if I had a top 5 or so PG which Hinrich is not.</p>
<p>Second stage &#8211; Bulls specifically and whether or not that swings the initial scale</p>
<p>I&#8217;d agree that the Bulls were better than they showed last season. I expected more from them, especially on the (1) defensive end and from (2) Hinrich and Deng. That said I thought the pre-season expectations last year where completely out of whack and that the Bulls were overrated. I did consider them a playoff caliber squad but also a team that would be lucky to get out of the first round (Boston, Detroit, Cleveland, Orlando all being better and likely one of who would play the Bulls in the opening round). With the improvements made once again this offseason that difference has grown even larger with the Bulls falling further down the pecking order. As I said at the start of this paragraph, I thought the Bulls underperformed and feel they can do better in the two areas I said above, plus hopefully some of their youth improves too &#8230; so better but a long way off from where they need to be.</p>
<p>So with where I evaluate the Bulls to be, even with a Beasley they don&#8217;t go get past the top five teams (add Phily to the other four) in the East.  I would like their chances to get back to the playoff picture though. I&#8217;d consider them in that Toronto/Washington bracket and still in need of making more moves, and important moves at that. Without Beasley I&#8217;m lukewarm on their chances, they&#8217;ve got a shot but so do several other squads.</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>As for moving Bulls guards, their good draft picks, I have no problem with that. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m don&#8217;t really like Ben Gordon and think the Bulls are mad for offering him so much money, and Ben is even madder for turning that deal down. I think he&#8217;s a fairly average player who is difficult to play off of as a go to scorer which limits his value as a scorer. He also creates a large number of problems, almost as many as he solves. And &#8230; his value to the Bulls is seriously inflated by the team&#8217;s offensive deficiencies over the past couple of years. Add in the tweener label, inability to play the point, defensive issues, limited playmaking &#8230;. like I said I regard him as a fairly average player.</p>
<p>I have no problem moving Kirk Hinrich when I&#8217;m inserting a top point guard prospect in his place.</p>
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		<title>By: K-man</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-457</link>
		<dc:creator>K-man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 14:41:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-457</guid>
		<description>Dave:

Ah, then I&#039;ll have to disagree with you on that.  I would have taken Beasley simply because some Bulls fans are sick of continuous sermons on potential from Bulls management. 

This draft pick has truly shifted my draft-on-potential paradigm.  
Sure, instincts are a good indicator of potential but everyone drafted into the NBA has instincts.  (Save some of your size-motivated picks and Tyrus Thomas, haha.)  If you&#039;re looking to compete now while having several guys in the oven (Thomas, Noah and Deng to an extent) does not scream &quot;let&#039;s draft another project!&quot;

And I think most of my perspective is grounded on a belief that the current Bulls roster (sans Rose) is much better than what they showed last season.

If you agree with me on that then it doesn&#039;t make sense to &quot;reach&quot; on a pick that makes several of your guards redundant.

If you don&#039;t think as highly of their roster then I would have to agree with your thinking.  In that respect, Paxson did not follow up that selection well.  However, I keep Gordon.  Move Hinrich and Hughes.  Keep Nocioni.  I realize Gordon becomes a defensive liability without Hinrich but whom else can Rose kick out to?  Hughes is a waste of space as long as Sefolosha is around.  Nocioni will find a way to score if he needs to and is scrappy enough to play 4 in a small line-up.

But again, dumping five years of great draft picks for a 19-year-old gamble just doesn&#039;t make sense to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dave:</p>
<p>Ah, then I&#8217;ll have to disagree with you on that.  I would have taken Beasley simply because some Bulls fans are sick of continuous sermons on potential from Bulls management. </p>
<p>This draft pick has truly shifted my draft-on-potential paradigm.<br />
Sure, instincts are a good indicator of potential but everyone drafted into the NBA has instincts.  (Save some of your size-motivated picks and Tyrus Thomas, haha.)  If you&#8217;re looking to compete now while having several guys in the oven (Thomas, Noah and Deng to an extent) does not scream &#8220;let&#8217;s draft another project!&#8221;</p>
<p>And I think most of my perspective is grounded on a belief that the current Bulls roster (sans Rose) is much better than what they showed last season.</p>
<p>If you agree with me on that then it doesn&#8217;t make sense to &#8220;reach&#8221; on a pick that makes several of your guards redundant.</p>
<p>If you don&#8217;t think as highly of their roster then I would have to agree with your thinking.  In that respect, Paxson did not follow up that selection well.  However, I keep Gordon.  Move Hinrich and Hughes.  Keep Nocioni.  I realize Gordon becomes a defensive liability without Hinrich but whom else can Rose kick out to?  Hughes is a waste of space as long as Sefolosha is around.  Nocioni will find a way to score if he needs to and is scrappy enough to play 4 in a small line-up.</p>
<p>But again, dumping five years of great draft picks for a 19-year-old gamble just doesn&#8217;t make sense to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-453</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-453</guid>
		<description>K-Man,

It isn&#039;t the Rose draft pick that I think is bad .... it&#039;s the lack of activity after the pick. There needed to be consequential roster changes in order to re-balance the roster and it never happened, or at least hasn&#039;t happened yet. 

If I was the one making that draft pick on draft night I too would have picked Derrick Rose ..... I just would have tried to trade half the roster between then and now. I would have cut Ben Gordon lose and moved Hinrich, moved Nocioni, and possibly a few others (Hughes if possible). Deng is the only one who&#039;d be a certainty to stay. 

If Paxson was never going to make those changes he should have taken Beasley. Beasley would have slid in beautifully (excellent fit) and the Bulls would have had the chance of being a contender in the East very quickly.

The reason I like the pick is that I believe Derrick Rose is the superior prospect and the player you&#039;ll want in three years time. He&#039;ll be a great building block for several Bulls squads over the next dozen years. 

_________________________________

As I said I&#039;m not convinced by how NBA ready Rose is, he has incredible instincts but his game lacks knowledge and understanding. He needs more experience and it shows. It&#039;s a big summer for him, we&#039;ll see how hard he&#039;s worked on his game. 

I expect Rose to be a solid player as a rookie but I doubt he&#039;ll be a star, hopeful that he will be a star caliber player by his second season though. I also think he&#039;d be a lot more successful as a rookie if he were playing in a less structured offense which Del Negro doesn&#039;t seem to be teaching .... allowing him to let his instincts run free and cause havoc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>K-Man,</p>
<p>It isn&#8217;t the Rose draft pick that I think is bad &#8230;. it&#8217;s the lack of activity after the pick. There needed to be consequential roster changes in order to re-balance the roster and it never happened, or at least hasn&#8217;t happened yet. </p>
<p>If I was the one making that draft pick on draft night I too would have picked Derrick Rose &#8230;.. I just would have tried to trade half the roster between then and now. I would have cut Ben Gordon lose and moved Hinrich, moved Nocioni, and possibly a few others (Hughes if possible). Deng is the only one who&#8217;d be a certainty to stay. </p>
<p>If Paxson was never going to make those changes he should have taken Beasley. Beasley would have slid in beautifully (excellent fit) and the Bulls would have had the chance of being a contender in the East very quickly.</p>
<p>The reason I like the pick is that I believe Derrick Rose is the superior prospect and the player you&#8217;ll want in three years time. He&#8217;ll be a great building block for several Bulls squads over the next dozen years. </p>
<p>_________________________________</p>
<p>As I said I&#8217;m not convinced by how NBA ready Rose is, he has incredible instincts but his game lacks knowledge and understanding. He needs more experience and it shows. It&#8217;s a big summer for him, we&#8217;ll see how hard he&#8217;s worked on his game. </p>
<p>I expect Rose to be a solid player as a rookie but I doubt he&#8217;ll be a star, hopeful that he will be a star caliber player by his second season though. I also think he&#8217;d be a lot more successful as a rookie if he were playing in a less structured offense which Del Negro doesn&#8217;t seem to be teaching &#8230;. allowing him to let his instincts run free and cause havoc.</p>
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		<title>By: K-man</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-450</link>
		<dc:creator>K-man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Sep 2008 13:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-450</guid>
		<description>Ah!!! Dave!!! Finally, someone agrees with me!

However, I am trying to stay positive about the Rose pick simply because I&#039;m a Bulls fan.

I think Hinrich has a good floor game.  But there aren&#039;t too many undersized collegiate wings that go on to become incredible floor generals.  Especially because he&#039;s never had a good post player to develop around.  He&#039;s done well with the tools that he has.

My comment about &quot;[limiting Hinrich&#039;s] turnovers to warrant some time at the pont&quot; was directed at the fact that many have anointed Rose already -- I definitely do not think he should be benched for Rose.  I&#039;m not at all excited about this team&#039;s changes in the short-term as I too think the Rose pick was horrendous given the current Bulls roster.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah!!! Dave!!! Finally, someone agrees with me!</p>
<p>However, I am trying to stay positive about the Rose pick simply because I&#8217;m a Bulls fan.</p>
<p>I think Hinrich has a good floor game.  But there aren&#8217;t too many undersized collegiate wings that go on to become incredible floor generals.  Especially because he&#8217;s never had a good post player to develop around.  He&#8217;s done well with the tools that he has.</p>
<p>My comment about &#8220;[limiting Hinrich's] turnovers to warrant some time at the pont&#8221; was directed at the fact that many have anointed Rose already &#8212; I definitely do not think he should be benched for Rose.  I&#8217;m not at all excited about this team&#8217;s changes in the short-term as I too think the Rose pick was horrendous given the current Bulls roster.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-448</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:56:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-448</guid>
		<description>The man was top 75 all-time in three point percentage (fell to 78 after last season). I think he gets too much undeserved criticism over his jump shot.

I&#039;ve never been that large of a fan on Kirk Hinrich. I&#039;m a big admirer of intelligent floor generals, creative floor generals ... and Kirk hasn&#039;t been that. He has other qualities but not the qualities I admire most in my point guard so I&#039;ve never rated him too highly. 

I think Hinrich&#039;s limitations offensively as a point guard will continue to halt his progress, and stop him from becoming an all-star caliber player. I think whatever team he joins, and Chicago should trade him, he&#039;ll need to be placed alongside a creative playmaking wing in order for his team&#039;s to challenge for a title. He&#039;d be an excellent fit next to someone like Brandon Roy in Portland (let&#039;s get that rumour going again).

Hinrich above average starting point guard? Top 15 in the league? I think so. There&#039;s no way he should be coming off the bench, Chicago have to let him live his career and let him move on. It&#039;s unfair to ask him to backup Derrick Rose. I&#039;ll be patient with it for now because I don&#039;t think Rose is ready to be a top tier point (love his medium term, long term potential) as a rookie, but if Hinrich is on this roster in 12 months time I&#039;m going to be livid .... and incredibly critical of John Paxson ruining a good player&#039;s career.

As for Chicago, almost their entire roster doesn&#039;t fit in with Derrick Rose. So many changes need to happen and none have happened. If I&#039;m a Bulls fan I&#039;m very depressed my team&#039;s activity following the drafting of Derrick Rose. If you wanted to keep your roster as is you should have drafted Beasley, and tried to piece together the rest and make a run at a title.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The man was top 75 all-time in three point percentage (fell to 78 after last season). I think he gets too much undeserved criticism over his jump shot.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve never been that large of a fan on Kirk Hinrich. I&#8217;m a big admirer of intelligent floor generals, creative floor generals &#8230; and Kirk hasn&#8217;t been that. He has other qualities but not the qualities I admire most in my point guard so I&#8217;ve never rated him too highly. </p>
<p>I think Hinrich&#8217;s limitations offensively as a point guard will continue to halt his progress, and stop him from becoming an all-star caliber player. I think whatever team he joins, and Chicago should trade him, he&#8217;ll need to be placed alongside a creative playmaking wing in order for his team&#8217;s to challenge for a title. He&#8217;d be an excellent fit next to someone like Brandon Roy in Portland (let&#8217;s get that rumour going again).</p>
<p>Hinrich above average starting point guard? Top 15 in the league? I think so. There&#8217;s no way he should be coming off the bench, Chicago have to let him live his career and let him move on. It&#8217;s unfair to ask him to backup Derrick Rose. I&#8217;ll be patient with it for now because I don&#8217;t think Rose is ready to be a top tier point (love his medium term, long term potential) as a rookie, but if Hinrich is on this roster in 12 months time I&#8217;m going to be livid &#8230;. and incredibly critical of John Paxson ruining a good player&#8217;s career.</p>
<p>As for Chicago, almost their entire roster doesn&#8217;t fit in with Derrick Rose. So many changes need to happen and none have happened. If I&#8217;m a Bulls fan I&#8217;m very depressed my team&#8217;s activity following the drafting of Derrick Rose. If you wanted to keep your roster as is you should have drafted Beasley, and tried to piece together the rest and make a run at a title.</p>
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		<title>By: mao</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-447</link>
		<dc:creator>mao</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:12:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-447</guid>
		<description>It should help the Bulls and Heinrich to know that Kobe Bryant isn&#039;t coming to take their jobs this year. I know that got kind of overplayed as a reason for why they sucked so much, but I think that really does make a difference when guys are looking over their shoulders, so to speak.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It should help the Bulls and Heinrich to know that Kobe Bryant isn&#8217;t coming to take their jobs this year. I know that got kind of overplayed as a reason for why they sucked so much, but I think that really does make a difference when guys are looking over their shoulders, so to speak.</p>
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		<title>By: Travis Outlaw</title>
		<link>http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/kirk-hinrich-07-08-synopsis/#comment-446</link>
		<dc:creator>Travis Outlaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 05:02:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feetinthepaint.wordpress.com/?p=276#comment-446</guid>
		<description>Kirk Hinrich is the next John Stockton.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kirk Hinrich is the next John Stockton.</p>
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